Do- It Molds and custom work Please give thoughts

[plateboater]

Hello All,

I have been talking with Do-It molds and custom work. I want walleye jig style 1/8 and tear drops. I want ultra head with no collar. Do-It needs to sell 100 or get commitments to place into production. What vendors can I call also.....Barlows but who else. How many guys are interested here
I tried to explain to the design engineer about voice of the customer!!! Thoughts please. I am on a mission

 

[Bucko]

I thought they already would have done an ultra minnow no collar by now. janns netcraft, lurepartsonline, tackle craft, zeiners, I know there's more but can't think of them right now.

 

[plateboater]

Thanks for the help

 

[Lost Pole]

Sweet

 

[CrappieHappy]

What doesn't make since too me from a business standpoint is saying they
Need 100 sold before they design it. They should do R&D , and know that those would
Sell easily. I would suggest you ask them to join several forums, and they
Will see the same consensus .

 

[hookup]

Sean Collins - but I've heard customer service issues.

His stuff is top notch to, so expect to pay 4-5x more than a Do It.

 

[Bucko]

Sean Collins - but I've heard customer service issues.

His stuff is top notch to, so expect to pay 4-5x more than a Do It.

400 more like it I've heard.

 

[Kdog]

I have seen this post or one similar on a couple sites and am surprised that there is no small machine shop or mold maker that is interested. However, looking at the situation from the economics side (reality check), I can understand the lack of interest. I did talk to a tool and die shop that does great work and the facts are quite simple. Between overhead and prototype work his estimate was $3500.00. To machine from solid even with CNC unit cost would be $125.00. So for 100 units, minimum would be $160.00 each. For his business, he said it would not be worthwhile.

Do-It OTOH is making some type of a investment casting. This requires a couple molds one for the investment (wax or foam)
One for the mold itself. Sure, tooling is not that expensive but the overhead is and for a hundred molds is hard to justify and in reality is probably a true break even point for them.

I have looked at centrifugal casting as well and have found a few mold makers that will make your mold for $150.00 and up plus materials ~50.00 per mold. Sounding good except now you need a spin casting set up ~3500.00 - 5,000.00 and a big melting furnace or just buy all new http://www.tekcast.com/pdf/fishing.pdf .

I still think the best option is to make your own mold. There are a number of options available but all are gonna cost some $ but I think the best option is a bondo mold. I haven't tried making one yet but will do so someday in the near future just for the fun of it.

For the time being, Red Silicone makes a great mold modifier and for more permanent mods, there is always JB Weld.

 

[plateboater]

K Dog....you are correct I currently work for Caterpillar in a shop of 1000 CNC the largest in the world. Talking with tech services I agree with expense. If you have program (eight hours) to mod take one hour to run a production mold BUT Do-it is foundry. So I also agree which the do not want to say is the break even is 100 for set-up, manpower and maybe autocad change of layout

Crappiehappie....design is already done! They just tweak a print before sending to foundry. That is my point to what KDog is explaining cost but they are out minimal cost to design SOOOOO instead of listening to customers feedback to run the mold they need commitments which I can understand to a certain point. I think I can make them open there eyes a bit! I did tell them that I am on three different forums wishing for the same thing!

GO TEAM JIGCRAFT

 

[toadfrog]

Do-It has never been know for taking customer requests or doing custom work . It is surprising that you even got to talk to someone at any length on the subject . They are however making some different moves lately . What that will result in eventually is hard to tell . If you are going to get a list of potential buyers together for that type of mold I would suggest sending that list to Rick Jacobs at Jacobs Baits with your request . He will not be able to make the exact mold but a rendition of it . It might interest him if there were committed customers on board . His work is premium .

 

[plateboater]

Toadfrog....agree! Have his molds and the 1/24 and 1/32 flipped to run more in mold is refreshing new ideas! Will talk with him! I think forward thinking for Do-it mold.....they need to be listening to voice of customer!

 

[CrappieHappy]

I would gladly support a smaller company like Jacobs!

 

[Ron Don]

Something I suggest to do with Jacobs is to stress that the weights be accurate. Im really not sure why he didn't go this route??? From what I understand he just took the diameter of Do It molds round heads and cut molds that size. We all know do its aren't accurate. And just like Do It he uses the same diameter head on ball heads as he does with collared heads. Yes its a little extra work but program once and its done! I tried to stress to him that this would be a great niche TO BE ACCURATE. Blows my mind to not do this when machining molds. So im curious to those that have the 1/24... Whats the weight?

 

[plateboater]

RonDon......I have not weighed out the 1/24 but will

 

[Kdog]

Accurate weights will always be tough. and on the smaller sizes will be even tougher to control. Metal quality and temperature when poured will have an effect as will mold temperature when poured. Rather than getting into all the details coefficents of thermal expansion, melting temp vs pouring vs mold temp. I am confident in saying that the smaller jigs will easily range 3-4 percent in weight from what is published for that mold

A 50 degree temperature change in the mold equates to 0.0016" per side or 0.0032 in overall mold thickness or 3 percent. There are a lot of ways to argue this data but the reality is pouring conditions will result in a deviation from mold design. Thus, a 1/24oz design could easily range +/ 3%. And the longer you cast, the hotter your mold will get, thus the larger your mold will be and the heavier your jig head will be.

Same thing with your metal, Lead melts at 621 degrees and has a coefficient of expansion of 19.1 (10) -6 per degree

Given all the variables, the weights are a reference. Linear size and shape are what we look for. But I am certain selling jigs by size would be a disaster. Aerospace tolerances aside, it would be next to impossible to make a perfect mold. Let alone measure it with any degree of reliability.

I have included a list of sizes and weights, yes I was bored today and did some calculations to determine what a perfectly round ball of lead would weigh and inversely what diameter ball would weigh what. The end result of those calculations are as follows:

Diameter 0.1429000 = weight 1/100 ounce
Diameter 0.1480000 = weight 1/90 ounce
Diameter 0.1539590 = weight 1/80 ounce
Diameter 0.1609466 = weight 1/70 ounce
Diameter 0.1694079 = weight 1/60 ounce
Diameter 0.1802407 = weight 1/50 ounce
Diameter 0.1939810 = weight 1/40 ounce
Diameter 0.2089000 = weight 1/32 ounce
Diameter 0.2134951 = weight 1/30 ounce
Diameter 0.2299500 = weight 1/24 ounce
Diameter 0.2443500 = weight 1/20 ounce
Diameter 0.2632500 = weight 1/16 ounce
Diameter 0.2752500 = weight 1/14 ounce
Diameter 0.2897500 = weight 1/12 ounce
Diameter 0.2982500 = weight 1/11 ounce
Diameter 0.3078500 = weight 1/10 ounce
Diameter 0.31885 = weight 1/9 ounce
Diameter 0.33165 = weight 1/8 ounce
Diameter 0.34675 = weight 1/7 ounce
Diameter 0.36505 = weight 1/6 ounce
Diameter 0.38790 = weight 1/5 ounce
Diameter 0.41785 = weight ¼ ounce
Diameter 0.45010 = weight 5/16 ounce
Diameter 0.45990 = weight 1/3 ounce
Diameter 0.47835 = weight 3/8 ounce
Diameter 0.50356 = weight 7/16 ounce
Diameter 0.52645 = weight ½ ounce
Diameter 0.54755 = weight 9/16 ounce
Diameter 0.56715 = weight 5/8 ounce
Diameter 0.58545 = weight 11/16 ounce
Diameter 0.60265 = weight ¾ ounce
Diameter 0.63445 = weight 7/8 ounce
Diameter 0.66325 = weight 1 ounce

Made the table because A, I was bored and B, someday I want to make a few of my own molds just for fun.

 

[Ron Don]

Ha Kdog not expecting exact but pretty close is very possible. I have several custom molds that are pretty much exact. When making the mold the maker would use purest lead they have. When someone is making and selling multiples of a mold, taking that extra time to get it right just makes sense to me. To me having a 1/16th oz mold that produces 1/12th oz head isn't close enough. That's a half size difference.

 

[toadfrog]

Lord have mercy , My fish are just old farm fish . They don't have that colledge degree long as they can find the lure they is a gonna eat it . Whether it weighs a milli speck one way or tuther . LOL Sorry guys couldn't help myself .

 

[plateboater]

All I can say Kdog is the man!!! Still looking for the VOC! I am not giving up. Just watched a youtube ice fishing show using a shad dart style body made by VMC in 1/16 to crush crappies. Do not want to by VMC just want my own!!

 

[Kdog]

All I can say Kdog is the man!!! Still looking for the VOC! I am not giving up. Just watched a youtube ice fishing show using a shad dart style body made by VMC in 1/16 to crush crappies. Do not want to by VMC just want my own!!

Volatile Organic Compound????

 

[plateboater]

Sorry......Voice of Customer which is critical to win.